The Practical Enneagram

That Spiral thing, with Dr Deborah Ooten

August 30, 2022 Rezzan Huseyin Season 1 Episode 44
The Practical Enneagram
That Spiral thing, with Dr Deborah Ooten
Show Notes

Another absolute beaut of an Enneagram teacher, the amazingly generous and fun Deborah Ooten PhD (Sexual 8, though she doesn't use instinct categorisations in her teachings) shares about why she saw fit to pair Spiral Dynamics with the Enneagram. Deborah’s work has been pioneering in the field. I encourage everyone to have at least an awareness of her research, know about her fantasy self-help series, the Books of Nine, and consider participating in her upcoming course with the Shift Network. 

  • What is Spiral Dynamics and who uses it? [2.20]
  • The three kinds of change that happen to prompt evolution on the Spiral [9.25]
  • Why did Deborah begin to teach Spiral Dynamics with the Enneagram? [15.05]
  • What Deborah did with a bunch of Enneagram teachers at an IEA conference [20.13] 
  • How not to be a simplistic a-hole (like me) about the Spiral and the Enneagram [22.33]
  • How does someone living in Blue, Orange and Yellow see the Enneagram (you can use this to figure out where you probably are on the Spiral)? [27.35] 
  • How do Riso and Hudson's Levels sit on the Spiral? [34.34]
  • How Deborah found her way to the Fourth Way as a spiritual path [38.36]

Find Deborah:
Deborah's website,


  • Gravian theory is a reference to Clare Graves, whose work Don Beck and Chris Cowan built their Spiral Dynamics model on.
  • Vmeme just means set of values. Values meme. 
  • 'Developmental allergy' is a fancy term for low development. 
  • 'We'/collective stages - Blue and Green.
  • ' Self-expressive' or Individualistic stages - Red and Orange.  
  • Link to Deborah's article outlining research:
  • Link to Books of Nine:
  • If this topic interests you, you might want to listen to: 'Type, the Spiral and disintegration', with Leslie Hershberger (Episode 7)  and 'The types in colour', with Dr Khaled ElSherbini (Episode 14)


Music by SergeQuadrado from Pixabay

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